In the first part of my sit-down interview with UT Arlington Athletic Director Jon Fagg, we had a great discussion regarding the Mavericks current home, the Western Athletic Conference, and its transition to the United Athletic Conference starting next year. It was a great talk with some behind the scenes information that wasn't generally known.
In that same theme, particularly the behind the scene workings, the Maverick Rambler looks behind the curtain of UTA's next, newest sport, coming at the dawn of the UAC. At the end of this edition, the topic starts to shift organically to one of the most common topics on campus.
Here's part two of the one-on-one with the UTA Athletic Director.
The Maverick Rambler: We're going to go back to ... to, to your President for a second. Because, one of the other big headlines: women's flag football.
Jon Fagg: Yeah, women's flag football!
TMR: I, I can't tell you how excited I am for two reasons. One: I just ... I'm just a sports guy. But two: this is not even an emerging sport yet by the NCAA standards.
JF: Exactly. It literally is in the process of becoming an emerging sport right now.
TMR: An here UTA is ... Like we still don't have women's soccer.
JF: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
TMR: Or, 20 years after everybody else had women's golf, before we ... My Alma Mater has a history of being more reactive.
JF: Yeah, yeah yeah, sure.
TMR: So the fact that we are on the front end of something, I can't tell you how exciting that is.
JF: Yeah, that's kinda why we... not kinda, that's partially why we did it. You know, again, ultimately I have to give credit, I mean, it is Dr. (Jennifer) Cowley's decision.
TMR: So talk about that process.
JF: Technically, you know technically. Sorry, I don't mean that. It IS her decision. It is.
TMR: Sure.
JF: We arrive at those decisions together for the most part. But I will be happy to talk about it. Because we've talked about it a little bit in the past. And it is fun and funny. So we've been talking about adding a sport since I have been here. You know, not constantly talking, but that is just part of strategy. Do we add? Do we not? And there were several candidates. You know, women's soccer, women's wrestling is actually a booming sport. Rugby, bowling, beach volleyball, stunt, acrobatics and tumbling, triathlon, there're lots of choices. And so, along the way, we've talked, we started narrowing a little bit and we started getting a little more serious. But I was, quite frankly, being relatively uncooperative.
TMR: How so?
JF: She would say I need this information and I wouldn't really give it to her very fast (chuckling), you know what I mean.
TMR: Is this for women's flag football or just in general?
JF: For anything. For anything, yeah. And so, because I have told her a few times that I don't think we have to add a sport yet. So I'm personally not ready. And you know, that's just my, my side of the equation. But maybe six months before we announced we started talking a little more seriously. We had gotten it down to a couple of choices. And again, she was asking for information and I was giving her SOME, and you know whatever. We have a monthly one-on-one. And in one of the monthly one-on-ones we were talking about it. And she was, "look!" She kinda got a little testy.
TMR: (Laughing)
JF: Look, I wanted, I like flag football. I did not...I mean I was voting for something else.
TMR: Sure.
JF: We basically got it down to two. And we have a great relationship and so I said, "Jennifer, you know I'm being uncooperative on purpose. I just want to make sure because I realize I'm being uncooperative and you know, maybe you don't know." And she kind of you know acknowledged, " yeah, I understand what you're saying." You know, I'm playing my role. Push and pull. Keep us even as best I can too. And I said like, "if you want me to stop being uncooperative, like if you really do, you just need to tell me." I don't mind. I'm just doing it because I think that should be my role, to try to limit expenses and all that kind of stuff.
TMR: Yeah, yea.
JF: So I said, "like if you want me to be uncooperative, you just need to tell me." She said, "stop being uncooperative." Like in one second (chuckling). I was like, ohh, okay.
TMR: Her mind was set.
JF: Yeah, and so we said okay, what do we want to do. And we kinda roughly decided, and I, I think the story is funny, we roughly decided that we would probably add flag football. That's what I thought.
TMR: About how long ago?
JF: This was, this conversation was probably, give or take, a week before we announced.
TMR: Wow, okay!
JF: Right? Because we had done all the research and we knew numbers and budgets and we had done all the stuff. It was more about making a decisions if we were going to ever make one. And so I was like, hey, if they, you know ... we kinda, I left my one-on-one roughly we were probably going to add flag football whenever we add a sport. Within ... certainly within three hours, probably more like two, I, one of my staff comes in, one of our staff comes in and says, "hey," whomever, "someone said I'm supposed to come to you and get the information about flag football." I'm like, "why are you talking about flag football?" He goes, "well we are adding flag football, right?" And I'm like, "who said we are adding flag football?"
TMR: (laughing)
JF: "This person did." "How does that person know anything about this?" 'Cause Dr. Cowley, one of the things I love about her, once we go, she wants to go. And so, I was like, I literally go "well I guess we added flag football." you know, I thought we were going to. I just didn't know we...
TMR: Right.
JF: It was my fault. I mean I say it fun. 'Cause I was like "oh, we really did say we are adding it. I thought she was going to think about it like a little longer, you know, or whatever. No, she decided let's go. And about a week or so later we..., I mean it might have been a couple of weeks, but yeah, pretty quick after that we announced.
And it just feels like it has so much upside.
TMR: Mm hmm. That's one of the exciting things.
JF: It's a really fun sport. It's fast. It's a lot like basketball. You know, it's not ... and I love football personally. I don't know if you know. I'm a college coach, son of a coach. It's faster than regular football. You know, it's not seven seconds and 40 seconds of standing. You know, it's...they, they jump back upon the line because the clocks are ... the game is relatively condensed. And ...
TMR: The field is smaller.
JF: The field is smaller, but not that small. You know, there's room to run around and you know, all that kind of stuff. And we've already had organizations or companies coming to us wanting to be a part of it.
TMR: Really?
JF: Oh yeah!
TMR: In what way?
JF: Wanting to be sponsors. Wanting to be, you know, wanting to invest. We already have, we're already seeing money coming in result of it, as a result of it. And so that's really cool.
TMR: So Texas Wesleyan announced in January and they had sponsors ready to go. They are playing next year.
JF: Yeah, yea, yea, yea.
TMR: Was the delay between y'all's two announcements, is that the reason we are looking at 2027?
JF: Not necessarily. I ... we ... practically speaking, announcing it in the spring, if we'd announced it earlier in the year, if we'd have made that decision, we potentially could have played in '26. But, in my mind, to be great, no need to rush in.
TMR: No.
JF: If you somehow rush in and you are not ready and you start off poorly, you may, you potentially never recover.
TMR: Right.
JF: You set the tone that we are not that good, at whatever we do. It doesn't really matter if you rush into something. And so, it was like, no. Let's just, we'll ... we ... I literally ... about to post a job, the head coach job. Maybe it is already posted, like as in today. which would be out next week if nothing else. Hire someone in a month or so.
TMR: Okay. So maybe September?
JF: Yeah. But ideally, hire in September. They'll immediately start recruiting. We have a list of people who have reached out ... you know, players who want to play.
TMR: Interesting.
JF: So, recruit, sign the first class this year. They'll enroll next fall. And then, then if it was a fall sport, they'd start playing. But the only reason you don't play until 2027 is because it is a spring sport. So, it's really one academic year to get it all up and running. And then you start playing.
TMR: Well since it is not an emerging sport, what kind of scholarship restraints are we looking at?
JF: Not many. And so we'll start giving some scholarships. And then ramp those up as we want or can afford to, you know. And then, when it is an emerging sport, you kind of play anybody who you can or want.
TMR: Sure.
JF: You're not limited to Division I or Division II or Division III, it's collegiate chances,
TMR: Also, it will be Texas Wesleyan, what, I think Mary Hardin Baylor...
JF: Yeah, there, but then there, there are many schools in Florida. There are many schools in the Northeast. But it's also, relatively speaking, it's a tournament-style competition. You don't need to, you don't play one football game a day or a week. You, what we hope, we are in the center of the country and an incredible airport to get to. And we will be able to host tournaments. And so you can go play just like volleyball does, or really youth basketball for sure. You come in and play three or four games in a weekend. You do that for a month or two and your season is done.
TMR: Or like softball they have that multi...
JF: Yeah, right exactly. Same thing as softball. Really same as many things, tennis or are similar to tennis. You can play multiple people in a weekend.
TMR: So I'm assuming scheduling is going to be a fly by your seat pants kind of thing initially.
JF: I would call it evolving (laughing).
TMR: That works too.
JF: I'm kidding. Yea, it will evolve. You know there's no real, real minimums or maximums to play. You know, so you have some flexibility. I think we'll end up being really, really popular.
TMR: Especially if we host that tournament thing.
JF: Yeah, if we host, we can host multiple tournaments. You know, but, it's going to be interesting to see. We already hear, we have people calling us saying we are thinking about adding it too. You know, all that kind of stuff.
TMR: Are you able to name any names there?
JF: Nah, that's not fair to them.
TMR: It, it was worth a try.
JF: That's good, they're not, it's not fair to them. But you know, seems like there is plenty of interest. you know, because it's, overall, you know, it's a relatively affordable sport. Meaning you don't need tons of equipment, tons of stuff. And we already have a football field, all the things you really need. We have almost all of them right now. And so, we'll need some locker room space, and you know stuff like that. but not much.
TMR: Speaking of the venue, your predecessor, probably sitting same spot you are, talking... I was talking with him and he described Maverick Stadium as a "dump." What is your opinion? 'Cause I personally don't see it as a dump. Obviously I see it as a 1980's stadium that hasn't had much large-scale renovation. But I still feel it is a fine football facility. Where am I ... where's the middle ground here?
JF: Easy, ballpark numbers right. Half a million-dollar track is less than six months old.
TMR: Yup.
JF: Half a million-dollar videoboard is less than two weeks old.
TMR: I haven't seen it yet. What's it look like for those who haven't either?
JF: It's a videoboard.
TMR: So it's different than what was there?
JF: Yea, oh yeah! It doesn't look anything like it. I mean it is a videoboard. So picture...you know it ... it's certainly not on the scale of big, huge stadiums. But it is a videoboard. You know, branding around it. It has a, I forget what it's called, analog or whatever, ribbon on the bottom of it. That, so if you didn't want to turn on the videoboard you could still keep score of a game.
And we have our first high school football game, the return of high school football...
TMR: I was going to ask about that next.
JF: ...to Maverick Stadium. Next Friday is our first game.
TMR: So is Arlington coming back or is this a different school?
JF: It is AISD.
TMR: Okay.
JF: I .... I, I'm not familiar with ... it's not just Arlington High School or Lamar...
TMR: I think back in the day, it was Arlington and Bowie. This was their home stadium. Lamar had theirs.
JF: I think it is more than that right now.
TMR: So it could be anybody?
JF: Yeah, I think it's all AISD opponents.
TMR: That's great.
JF: And so there's I believe 11 games this year.
TMR: That's great.
JF: We hope it'll be more moving forward. I mean yeah, really cool. You know, so, so, it needs, it needs work.
TMR: Sure.
JF: And the infrastructure is not pretty, which you don't see the infrastructure. The exterior is actually really nice.
TMR: Yea.
JF: The turf looks good. The track looks fantastic. The videoboard looks fantastic, it's a, you know, a big, black TV screen. like it's supposed to be, so to speak.
And that was Dr. Cowley wanting to do that as well. Wanting to imp... it gives us the ability to attract prospective students.
TMR: Well, if I'm not mistaken, it is still a regional host for track...
JF: Right.
TMR: ....high school track.
JF: It amplifies their experience. I hope and trust that we think we can attract USATF, US Track and Field, youth events. It is the center of the country, brand new track, videoboard, 12,000 seats, you know.
TMR: Yup. Can't beat that.
JF: We host, we hosted the WAC championships this year and one of the AD's (athletic director) came in with his team and was like, "this is phenomenal." And again, it was such a great reminder that what you see everyday loses its luster. Even if it is not bad. And he's like, "this is phenomenal. I would love to have this at my school."
TMR: So what do you think made Baker say it was a dump?
JF: 'Cause it is old. You know, and again I don't, I don't ...
TMR: I'd say coming from UT-Austin, Memorial Stadium is fairly old too.
JF: Well yeah. But I mean like, when I got here, yes you could spend a lot of money.
TMR: I see what you're getting at.
JF: You could spend a lot of money.
TMR: We just wanted modern amenities that we don't have.
JF: Well it certainly doesn't have that.
....
You could spend twenty million bucks, easily.
TMR: Well you could do that for any stadium.
JF: Yeah, but I mean ... but I mean like, in actual budget is 20 million dollars.
TMR: I see what you are saying.
JF: That's in actual budget for one model. Now that's also renovating it to use for a lot of stuff.
TMR: Well, I'll tell you one of my big pet peeves is that the history kind of gets neglected there.
JF: Yeah.
TMR: That's ESPN's first football broadcast in the history of that network.
JF: I don't know that.
TMR: Uhh, the nine ... the, the, the, the home ...
JF: I don't know that, no.
TMR: I don't know the home opener, the, the, the, the stadium opener against North Texas, September 6, 1980 was the very first ESPN college broadcast. Chris Berman sat up there in one of those press boxes.
JF: Really?!?
TMR: A hundred percent. one hundred percent. And that's what I talk ... that's the stuff I talk about. There's history there. And so I remember being a high school broad..., er a broadcaster here broadcasting the high school football games just thinking about the history. Am I sitting where, where that occurred?
In fact, do y'all still have your old media guides for the football program?
JF: We have them somewhere, yea. I think there...
TMR: Check the 1981 media guide. I have one at home. And you flip through there, one of the, one of the pictures of Bud Elliott (former head coach) pictures has the ESPN background in the back and it, it, it pertains to that game.
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| This is not the photo referenced, but is related to the broadcast of the stadium premiere. |
JF: Hmm.
TMR: Now back then, ESPN was nowhere near what it was today, of course.
JF: Yeah, yeah, yea.
TMR: So it was just like, oh that's cool. It would be no, like the Arlington local broadcast team or something like that.
JF: Yeah, yeah, yea.
TMR: But considering what it morphed into, the fact that that's the first one.
JF: Gotcha, gotcha.
TMR: 'Cause they were scrapping for content. They, they put everything they could on air.
JF: Yeah, yeah, yea, exactly, absolutely.
....
I love the ESPN thing. So even... Again, if not for ... We've been working on ways to increase our revenue, increase our brand. And I, and one of the things I think is super important, when I say our brand, that is not athletics.
TMR: Okay.
JF: The brand is the University. We are a great mechanism to increase the brand. We are the mechanism.
TMR: The important one.
JF: The primary mechanism right. Exactly. And so we, we work on ways to increase the brand.
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