Conversation with an AD Part Three - Gridiron Gossip

In part two of a long sit down interview with the UT Arlington Athletic Director Jon Fagg, we both discussed the start of the Mavericks flag football team. The topic transitioned to Maverick Stadium and teetered towards the men's side of the pigskin.

For part three of a one-on-one interview with the AD, we jump all in to football.

The Maverick Rambler: If you had a dollar for every time football was brought up to you in some capacity...

Jon Fagg: I'd have some money already. 

TMR: You'd be able to buy a private island.

JF: Not quite yet. Because before I would buy a private island, I would buy football potentially.

TMR: Sure. Absolutely.

JF: I'm kidding. Football is, you know, football is a thing, you know, that the, the answer, I mean the answer is to a couple of things. We need to focus on the sports we have first. 

TMR: Mm hmm.

JF: We need to build them, we need to be better at them overall.

TMR: I'd say as a whole, this University has made great progress in that regard. We used to just be happy just competing for Southland championships.  

JF: Yeah. yeah, yeah, yea.

TMR: You know we made a good run in the NIT tournament and that would have been unthinkable in the 2000's.

JF: Yeah, yeah, yeah, and so, but in my mind, and one of the reasons why I'm here, I think one of the reasons why Dr. Cowley hired me, one of the reasons why I like it here and stay here, I think we have great upside in more than one sport. But if we don't have football, that makes basketball our flagship. We have great upside in basketball.

TMR: We just haven't received it yet.

JF: I genuinely believe we can be a power, a mid-major power in basketball. We have all the tools. We have the facilities. We have the location. We have the school. We have not done a great job of continuing our momentum. We've HAD some momentum, but it's managed to fall back off. That, that happens. We talk a lot here, success is not a straight line. Success, success is a crooked line.

TMR: Especially in this era.

JF: Yes, success is a crooked line. But I think we can be great. And so, that's part of this. First, we want to see if we can be great in our sports. Can we emphasize our sports better, more, all the above? And then, you know, football comes up and it is hard. Football is a math problem. And it is not even algebra.

TMR: No.

JF: It is adding.

TMR: Straight addition.

JF: It is a straight addition. It is not adding AND subtracting. It's addition. And we need money. If there's anyone out there who wants to give us money, or people who want to give us money, we don't ... we, as best I can understand, we kind of have been describing it in the past, kind of as if one donor would suddenly come forward and give us the money,

TMR: Right

JF: ...as opposed to going and raising the money. So what we kinda do, I mean we talk to, we do a bunch of stuff with football players now. We had a football reunion ...

TMR: I saw that.

JF: ...in '23. I think we haven't announced it yet but we're going, we're having a football reunion for homecoming this year.

TMR: Awesome.

JF: I think we are in the process of getting that out. Mostly because we want them to know they're welcome.

TMR: I think for a long time, they haven't felt it. That was my inkling.

JF: That's what we understood too. That's why we did the reunion before. That's why we're doing it. We told them we were going to do it more than once. So we're going to invite them back for homecoming and make sure they ... we're not going to recognize them the same way we did last time. We're not here to ask them for things. We just want you to feel welcome, a part of our University. Excuse me, a part of your University.

TMR: It's funny how those can go together hand-in-hand. 

JF: So that's really the answer. If we, I think if we thought we had enough money, then the conversation might be different. Not automatically different.

TMR: How much did the student vote from a couple of years ago come into these conversations?

JF: That's one of the reasons why we added flag football. Because, right, if we added football, we'd have to add some other sports.

TMR: Sure.

JF: So instead of trying to add football and then chase other sports, right, we decided to add to some more ... we're gonna ... we might add another sport.

TMR: Well I'll say, we've added two women's sports in that time. We ... we are on that goal.

JF: Yeah, yea. And so, so, we're trying to always ... no one wants to shut the door. No one means to shut the door. It is, it is a math problem. You need, you know, again, I ... I ... I ... make this very public, I told the football players when they were here, so they would know what to say, I mean what to think about it for some reason if they wanted to. You need 30 to 50 million.

TMR: Well I mentioned holding off on it. This is a good time. You look at North Texas in the American Athletic. You look at you know, the Sun Belt, rising in stature. Those were all our peers from the '70's, 80's, 90's and 10's.

JF: Sure, yeah, yea.

TMR: And it feels like some of them have passed us by simply because we don't offer the sport.

JF: And I understand that. And I mean, and, and I, I understand that completely. Academically ...

TMR: Oh yeah! It's not even close.

JF: We passed them by. 

TMR: One hundred percent.

JF: And so I think what has happened here, the judge ... the judgement has been that that success is better or more valuable or whatever, it doesn't matter, you know, because I'm also talking about people I don't know, has been worth it and not this. Those schools, people really, they truly don't understand how tenuous it is underneath. 

TMR: Well I'm wondering.

JF: It's just, football is so difficult. And it's getting a lot worse.

TMR: I was about to say, I'm wondering when the house of cards is gonna fall.

JF: Whooooo!

TMR: So there's, so I, I, I'm .... I'm ... I'm in two boats. I would love nothing more than to sit in the stands, or I love, my dream job one day is to be color commentary for the football team.

JF: (laughing)

TMR: Like I think about that quite often.

JF: Yeah, yeah, yea.

TMR: The other end of the spectrum is a decade ago, five, six million got you where you needed to go.

JF: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

TMR: ...At FBS, competitively got you where you needed to go. I don't even know that that's close anymore.

JF: Now, and this is not ... this is a fact. Now five million is the application fee.

TMR: Yup.

JF: Right? That's how much it costs to apply...

TMR: Yup.

JF: ...to play football. So, for full, kind of transparency, not even full disclosure, if we played football, if we ever did, we would play FCS football not FBS.

TMR: And you know what? I'm, I would be so happy with that. Watching, again...

JF: Yea, yea.

TMR: ...now Tarleton, again, they, they've ...they've got that trajectory, but.

JF: Yea, you would, you would not start playing FBS football. I, I don't believe. I, I'm, I. That would not be my recommendation.

TMR: I think even UT San Antonio played one year with the intention of moving up.

JF: I feel like they might have played (in FCS), yeah.

And UT San Antonio, everybody talks about that, it's just such a different scenario, right. They don't have the same stressors that UTA does. They don't have the same competition for dollars and attention that, that Dallas/Fort Worth and Arlington and Dallas Cowboys and Texas Rangers and all that, Dallas Mavericks, all the pressures, Dallas Wings, all the pressures. And so ... but, we have people tell us they are interested in giving for football. We have, we tried to get people to give us, if you want to give for football, you should give now so we can add sports so we can get to football. If you really want to hold off, that's your business.

TMR: I'll give him credit. He's a former tennis alum. He goes by Duck on my, on my blog. Mac, and I'm going to mispronounce his last name, I believe it's Whiddon. Anyway, he's always said why don't we have a, a fundraising campaign. So Lamar is a great example. They dropped shortly after we did. They said, "hey, we are going to do this campaign." Of which many, many things are involved, including renovation of the football stadium to bring the football team back. And they more than met their goal. He's always said, we feel, and I don't disagree with him, that UTA could do something similar and have these exciting folks, "here, give ten bucks, fifty bucks."

JF: Uhhmm, add some zeros to those.

TMR: Well, but I'm saying, it all adds up from the short guys. And then, y'all are putting out a lot of the fundraising ...

JF: I, I've ... Again, I'd have to say I think because I think that's just the appropriate way to say it. We could. You're correct. We have not.

TMR:  Any reason?

JF: I think, again I think the general idea is that we need to raise money. Do you want to pour it into football with no guarantee of any kind that it will be successful or not. Or do you want to take what we have, the, the, the, if nothing else, the frame that we already have, and try to make that picture more colorful, or better, or, or more valuable or whatever. And, so ... and the, in the immediate term, Dr. Cowley and I have been here for three years and we've had plenty of things unfortunately - and fortunately - that we've been working on that have, that have just been seemingly more ... more attainable goals. You know, let's get, let's get these goals knocked out, you know.

TMR: Yea.

JF: And I'll describe it this way as well. When we first started fundraising, at least ... I'm not suggesting that, you know, I, I laugh that this place has been here long before me. It will be here long after. And I also laugh every once and a while that time did not exist before me.

TMR: Right.

JF: I control the very sunrise and sunset. (laughing) You know, I control it all, because I'm the one in charge right now. And so, in some ways, it only matters what I've been doing. Because that's what I'm held accountable, responsible for. And so, like we, I feel like let's pour effort into showing value of athletics at UTA.

TMR: Yeah.

JF: Not worrying about whether there's value in football or not. Right? And I, so, so we have had great fundraising success. I think people are listening that the value of athletics is here and we're growing. And to make it grow even more, if you want it to be better, that takes finances. That takes resources.

TMR: Yeah.

JF: It takes time, talent and treasure. It takes time. It takes talent. And it takes treasure. (laughing)

TMR: I'd almost say treasure goes first.

JF: Well, yeah. But ... exactly. I, I I kinda goof around sometimes. Yeah, time, talent, treasure. Like I need 'em all. And I need some treasure. And it's, people have responded. I think that, you know, if we ever realized that it was closer than we thought, maybe, maybe that would change our thinking. But I think that right now, especially ... I mean I love football. I owe my life to football, literally. There's some ...

TMR: Your bio kinda got some fans excited by the way. I just want to point it out.

JF: (laughing) yeah, yeah, yea.

TMR: (laughing)

JF: You know, I laughed at Jennifer about that. Like, do you think they are going to say that you're gonna bring football, you know all the things.

I think the idea that, again, let's just pour our efforts into this. And see what happens.